Congratulations on the Shop Opening! Aiming to be the Adult Jeans Mate!?

Tomoki Sukezane (hereinafter, Sukezane)It’s been a while. Thank you for having me. The store is finally here. Congratulations on the opening.

Tsuyoshi Noguchi (hereinafter, Noguchi)Thank you. You came to the reception the other day, but when was the actual opening day?

SukezaneYour own store! Don't you know? Was that the opening day? I believe it was August 5th.

NoguchiThen it opened on August 6th, yes.

SukezaneAnd the store's name?

NoguchiMINED. It's simply "denim" spelled backward.







NoguchiThat's right. Basically, I decided to only do denim. T-shirts and jackets are also made of denim material. I plan to continue with that concept for a while. I'm aiming to be the adult Jeans Mate.^※2(Laughs).

SukezaneIt's an understandable analogy at first glance, but it's not as cheap as Jeans Mate, is it?

NoguchiIdeally, I want it to be like a select shop. But that's not possible right away. I want to handle denim from various brands. So, like a Jeans Mate (laughs).

SukezaneDesigner brands also always release jeans, are you planning to stock those as well?

NoguchiYes. I'd like to stock them if possible.

SukezaneThat's interesting. When did you come up with the idea?

NoguchiI've been thinking about opening a denim store for a while.

SukezaneIs it ultimately because denim is what you love the most?

NoguchiYes. Basically, it's because I always wear them.

SukezaneYou have an eccentric number of jeans.

NoguchiAn abnormal number. I counted recently and there were about 480 pairs. I wonder what I'm going to do with them.

SukezaneBut it's 480 pairs because you're particular about them, not just any 480 pairs, right?

NoguchiWell, yes.

SukezaneAnd maybe about 100 of them have never been worn?

NoguchiMore than half? Some haven't been worn even once.

SukezaneBut you know where about 200 of them are?

NoguchiYes, yes. I generally keep track, but the ones I know I'll never wear are folded and packed away.

SukezaneSo, the 480 pairs are the ones you want to keep, having discarded what you don't need.

NoguchiYes. Even so, I sometimes think I should get rid of some...

SukezaneThat's a man's way of thinking. Decisive. Unlike me, you don't hoard.

NoguchiYou hoard too much! When I had a garage sale before, I even brought back the unsold items. Thinking it's a waste, I'll take them back (laughs). Normally, you'd want to go home empty-handed!

SukezaneWe'll save that story for chapter two (laughs). Let's talk about the store. Are the original jeans the ones with the largest selection?

NoguchiAnd also, processed items from Levi's. Remakes made by disassembling original Levi's. For Levi's, I buy vintage jeans and remake them. So each piece has a different look. They are basically 501s.

SukezaneThe color is beautiful. Is the design basically the same?

NoguchiYes, yes. This is the version for now.

SukezaneIt's interesting. Even with the same model, each piece is different.

NoguchiFor example, we can't leave the stitching as is, so we attach a patch pocket from another body. Or we attach excess fabric from when we adjust the knees to another body.

SukezaneThat's quite intricate.

NoguchiThe artisans are working hard on it.

SukezaneIt's nice, chic. Why did you arrive at this particular approach?

NoguchiI thought it might be too much to jump into something too difficult right away. There's the customer's perspective, and it's easier to work with the knees.

SukezaneIt's a good remake. There's nothing else like it.

NoguchiThere are quite a few for women's.

SukezaneIt's hard to choose, but I kind of want this one.

NoguchiPlease do. If you tell me, I can also finish the hems to your liking, like adding fading or other treatments. We also have black. The fabric is original. Jeans with black warp and weft threads are rare.

SukezaneOh, really? So one of the threads isn't black?

NoguchiYes, there's white thread in one of them. Not black. Even then, it's like women's "ozashiki denim."^※3That's not really denim, is it?

SukezaneStretchy leggings. Like ninjas.

NoguchiOur black jeans are quite stretchy. You can wear them even in an ozashiki setting (laughs). Luxury brand jeans often hurt the back of the knees, don't they?

SukezaneThey do. This black one is heavy and beautiful. It fades when washed, right?

NoguchiBut I think it fades less than regular ones.

SukezaneBased on years of experience, I assume?

NoguchiYes. Ultimately, if it's not made to your specifications with original materials, it won't be to your taste.

Page02.A Collection of Denim Crafted with Years of Experience

A Collection of Denim Crafted with Years of Experience

Sukezane(Pointing to the waist icon) What is this?

NoguchiI thought it would be lonely without an icon, so I added one. The inside is leather.

SukezaneIt's nice. It's memorable.

NoguchiYoung people these days don't wear belts.

SukezaneThey don't. Why do you think that is?

NoguchiThe rise of pants is deeper than before, and they wear them fitted and tuck in their T-shirts. So, maybe they don't need belts. I can understand the sentiment, though...

SukezaneNot wearing belts isn't limited to jeans; it's common in overseas magazines like "GQ," isn't it? Even with suits, belts are often omitted. (Pointing to the denim) What about this one?

NoguchiThat's raw denim. It stretches a bit. Black warp and weft threads. This is a slim straight.

SukezaneIt has a bit of a 501 vibe. It generally looks slim.

NoguchiYes. They say only black denim sells. For a while, rigid jeans sold so well, but it's calmed down now.^※4but it's calmed down now.

SukezaneMaybe people got tired of it. I understand that feeling. But I'll be back.

NoguchiYes. For next spring and summer, I'm making slightly flared, wider ones.

Sukezane(Pointing to another pair of jeans) Are these also for sale?

NoguchiThey're processed to look about that much. I took jeans I was wearing to a processing factory. I have a sample at the factory now, of my personal A.P.C. jeans that I wore for two years without washing, only dry cleaning them. I asked them to replicate that look, but they couldn't. After more than 10 attempts, we finally got something very close. I'm currently making that into a product.

SukezaneHow many times did you dry clean those A.P.C. jeans?

NoguchiAbout once every month and a half to two and a half months, so about 10 times in total.

SukezaneWhat's the biggest difference?

NoguchiBecause water wasn't used. And due to the heat, it develops a slight sheen or luster. Only the faded areas lose color, and it becomes somewhat oily, as if heat has been applied. So, the look is completely different from jeans washed with water.

SukezaneSo they remain stiff? Can you maintain that with just dry cleaning?

NoguchiYes, yes, you can. It's not exactly like new, of course. There are whiskers and tears too.

SukezaneWhy did you think this particular processing was good?

NoguchiWhile there are authentic processed denim items, I hadn't seen anything like the processing on my A.P.C. jeans that I wore for two years with only dry cleaning. So, when I told the guy who does the processing, 'I want to do this,' he immediately said, 'Mr. Tsuyoshi, that's impossible.' But I insisted, knowing it was difficult, and asked him repeatedly.

SukezaneWhy did he say it was impossible?

NoguchiIt's quite difficult to do without using water.

SukezaneWhat exactly is dry cleaning? How does it clean things?

NoguchiI don't know. I'd have to ask them for details, maybe Hakuyosha (laughs).

SukezaneThey say water washing is best for removing dirt.

NoguchiIsn't it washed with organic solvents?

SukezaneIs the craftsman you asked young?

NoguchiAround his mid-30s, I'd say.

SukezaneDid he easily grasp the feeling you intended when you showed him the A.P.C. jeans you'd worn for two years?

NoguchiYes. He likes it too. It took over a year, with more than 10 retries, but we finally achieved a satisfactory result.

SukezaneSo, it took a year to achieve what you did with A.P.C. jeans worn for two years. That's quite a story.

NoguchiQuite a bit, yes.

SukezaneThe first floor of this store is the ready-made sales floor. And the second floor?

NoguchiIt's exclusively for custom order customers.



SukezaneBespoke.

NoguchiYes, yes. For example, if someone is athletic and has thick thighs, they have to buy jeans that fit their thighs, so the waist becomes too loose. But if they want to wear skinny jeans, they can get a perfect fit with a custom order. People with disposable income often have slightly unusual body types, don't they? (laughs).

SukezaneStop saying that. Why is that?

NoguchiThere are so many people who want to wear slim pants even though they have a belly, so I thought, 'Shall we do it?' The silhouette also changes depending on the length, doesn't it? Full custom order for those people.

SukezaneIt's a matter of length, isn't it?

NoguchiThey don't have inch-by-inch sizing like they used to, do they?

SukezaneSo maybe that's why they wore them fitted?

NoguchiAs adults, you don't see that much anymore.

SukezaneThey used to sell them properly.

NoguchiYes, they did.

SukezaneWell, anyway, if the length isn't right, the silhouette doesn't come out properly.

NoguchiI also made buttons in silver, 14K, and 18K. I thought nobody would actually use them. But surprisingly, many people do.



SukezaneDon't you want to focus on details like these?

NoguchiI was surprised.

SukezanePure gold, and so on. Doesn't that create a distinction for the person wearing them? Dolce & Gabbana used to have incredibly expensive jeans that sold well, with amazing attention to detail in the parts and embroidery.

NoguchiGucci does that too, doesn't it? With embroidery and selectable designs.

SukezaneIn Milan. I went there.

NoguchiOh, you went?

Page03.The Relentless Pursuit of Denim Continues

The Relentless Pursuit of Denim Continues

SukezaneI wanted to buy something. Suits are nice, but suits aren't interesting, are they? This spring, I bought a blue blouse that I really liked. The material and the cut were great, and I thought, 'Ah, this is nice.' Then, at the Milan store, there was a custom order corner. They had about 20 types of patterns and fabrics. I previously ordered a perfect tunic-like shape with no buttons on the front or back, with a castle pattern. They said it would take six weeks.



NoguchiMust have been expensive.

SukezaneA little over 200,000 yen.

NoguchiNo way. Impossible for 200,000.

SukezaneAround 300,000 yen. They said it would arrive in six weeks, but we're already entering the sixth week.

NoguchiThe Italians are still on holiday, aren't they?

SukezaneWell, even if it arrives now, I won't be wearing it, so it's fine. But that service is good, isn't it?

NoguchiThere are customers who want to differentiate themselves that way.

SukezaneIndeed. Is it becoming more common?

NoguchiNo, I don't think there are many.

SukezaneThat's great. And when they say only Milan can do it, you want to go, right?

NoguchiYes.

SukezaneAre those kinds of customers coming to the second floor?

NoguchiCurrently, I'm only serving acquaintances. I don't have the capacity for complete strangers yet.

SukezaneProduction can't keep up?

NoguchiYes.

SukezaneSo, you have many acquaintances with such concerns?

NoguchiYes, there are. Though not just my acquaintances.



SukezaneYou've opened a denim store like this, and you've been wearing jeans for so long. What is the appeal of jeans?

NoguchiUnlike women, men don't have many choices for bottoms, right? Basically, it's suits, jeans, or chinos. And I don't wear suits. What is it? I've been wearing them for so long.

SukezaneYou say you don't wear suits, but what's the value in coming this far without wearing them? In other words, you dislike them, don't you? You don't want to wear them?

NoguchiI don't know. For me, suits mean short hair, and I think a tie looks cool, but I have long hair (laughs). Long hair with a suit looks flashy, doesn't it? (laughs). I don't think that's good. But when I wear jeans with a leather jacket or anything else, and I see an older guy with long hair wearing Chrome Hearts and tucking his jeans into boots in Minato Ward, I think, 'From a stranger's perspective, I'm in the same category as that guy.' (laughs). No, no, I have to stop that. It's off-putting. Sometimes I see them in front of Chrome Hearts stores too.

SukezaneFor those people, you are probably an aspirational figure (laughs).

NoguchiIt's not good. I need to rethink it. Seeing that makes me think, maybe I should cut my hair and change my image (laughs).

SukezaneI've never seen you with short hair in the last 30 years. There was a time you got angry when they cut it.

NoguchiYes, yes. It was cut quite a lot. How much did they cut?

SukezaneThey cut it without permission!

NoguchiYes. They cut it drastically. How much did they cut!

SukezaneI remember that incident. You came back from the studio and were furious. When I asked what was wrong, you said they cut it without permission!

NoguchiExactly!

SukezaneYou were with a girl, weren't you?

NoguchiYes, yes, yes.

SukezaneNostalgic.

NoguchiBecause of that, I'm hesitant about suits. So I tend to go for jeans.

SukezaneThat's understandable. Long hair with a suit is quite risky. I used to do it, though. Long hair with a suit is indeed risky.

NoguchiWithin jeans, there's a range of choices, right? Even with rigid jeans, each has a different look. It's masturbation, but the variety is fun.

SukezaneRight. Isn't that a very subtle difference? It's in those subtle differences that you find one that's cooler, isn't it?

NoguchiYes. To a third party, they might look like the same pants, but to me, there's a subtle difference.

SukezaneBut isn't that difference important? It's the appeal of jeans, isn't it? That discerning eye enhances their value.

NoguchiEven if you buy three pairs of the same rigid denim and wear them alternately for a year, they will all turn out differently.

SukezaneYou said that before. Buying three pairs of A.P.C.

NoguchiYes, yes. That's also interesting.

SukezaneEven if they were bought at the same time, the way you treat them makes them look different. That's very interesting. That's another way to enjoy them.

NoguchiIt's purely masturbation, though.

SukezaneNo, no, no. It's fashion. It's nothing else. Your pursuit of jeans will only deepen from here on. And now you've even opened a store.

NoguchiYes (laughs).

SukezaneYour relationship with denim won't end, will it? It's for life. There's no end goal, is there? Make this your denim grave.

NoguchiMaybe I should add some processing (laughs).



SukezaneOh, but you don't have a rigid denim image, do you? It's all black.

NoguchiEspecially recently.

SukezaneWhat about your preferences in that regard?


NoguchiIt comes and goes. Sometimes I think I'll wear rigid jeans for a while, or maybe wear processed Levi's. Lately, it's been a lot of black.

SukezanePeople might not know, but there was a time you wore pure white jeans.

NoguchiYes, yes.

SukezaneDo you not have that fresh look these days?

NoguchiNot at all (laughs)! White denim, 501s. I wore them, I wore them.

SukezaneI remember seeing you in pure white Helmut Lang jeans at the Milan airport. Is that not a frequent item for you?

NoguchiNot at all (laughs).

SukezaneWhat was that about?

NoguchiI probably just wanted to try wearing them. A kind of fresh look?

SukezaneAbout 15 years ago?

NoguchiDuring my Popeye days, I did a project with 501s and wore them then.

SukezaneLate 90s to early 2000s? You wore white.

NoguchiI also liked Helmut Lang's muted beige.

SukezaneI remember that. It suited you.

Page04.The Interior: Not Your Typical Denim Shop, with White Walls and Parquet Flooring

The Interior: Not Your Typical Denim Shop, with White Walls and Parquet Flooring

SukezaneI like the atmosphere of this store. It would fit in overseas, like in LA.

NoguchiMaybe. Denim shops often smell like oil or have a workshop feel, don't they? I didn't want that. I preferred something that looked a bit modern, even with the wood. White walls would be good for displaying the products clearly.





SukezaneThe gimmick is effective and interesting. The wood colors are also skillfully used in points, creating a nice effect.

NoguchiI used oak and about two other types. With the pocket concept, I worked with an interior designer. We thought about it as marquetry. It was expensive~.

SukezaneIt must have been expensive. I've never seen anything like it. It's nice. Are you also selling jewelry?

NoguchiA little. It would be too lonely with nothing else.

SukezaneYou've always worn silver accessories, haven't you?

NoguchiYes. There are many other nice things. I've always thought about making something out of silver dollar coins, so I made a bangle out of them.

SukezaneIs it original?



NoguchiI took it to a place that does accessory processing called END, and asked them to make it like this.

SukezaneIt's beautiful. The watch you're wearing today is Tokiokumagai.^※5It is.

NoguchiNostalgic.

SukezaneIt's cool.

NoguchiIt's still cool. It doesn't look old.

SukezaneIt's probably Tokiokumagai's bestseller. The fact that you still have it is impressive. Over 30 years ago? Did you buy it around the time you debuted and appeared in that show?

NoguchiYes, yes. But this was a gift from Kiyonaga-kun.^※6And I replaced the belt, so it's new.

SukezaneYou've always preferred silver for accessories, haven't you? From Chrome Hearts to Gabor.^※7

NoguchiNo, I didn't really get into Chrome Hearts. Maybe just a ring?

SukezaneI see. So, Leonard and Gabor? I found some Leonard pieces when I was cleaning my room the other day. Very elaborate ones. What's the relationship between silver and denim for you? Leather pants go well with silver, but is denim and silver a bit different?

NoguchiI don't know. Back then, Gabor was known through people like Mano.^※8I introduced him or wore his pieces because I knew people. Separately from that, I used to buy a lot of Hermès silver.



SukezaneYou did buy it!

NoguchiI preferred Hermès, actually.

SukezaneIndeed, indeed. You wore Hermès.

NoguchiI bought small things frequently.

SukezaneI remember asking you to buy an Hermès watch for me at the Saint-Honoré store in Paris.

NoguchiYes, really. That's why items like the Chaine d'Ancre,^※9are popular now, but they were very cheap back then.

SukezaneYou were an Hermès collector too.

NoguchiI was. I should have brought an Hermès blouson. I forgot.

SukezaneSpeaking of Hermès, that was it. You appeared in Popeye wearing an Hermès blouson. It was an easy styling. 'Wear your own clothes!'

Page05.The Fascination and Wonder of Bringing Together Years of Experience

The Fascination and Wonder of Bringing Together Years of Experience

SukezaneSo, is there anything else you'd like to say about the store?



SukezaneWhen Steven Klein had his photo exhibition in Daikanyama, I brought Tom Ford and took him there. That just reminded me.

NoguchiNostalgic.

SukezaneIt makes you see the background, the things you've built up. It feels good. Things come together in places like this. Still, Steven Klein back then was so uncool.

NoguchiRight? (laughs).

SukezaneHe was just an uncool guy, then he got skinny, became cool, and had a huge breakthrough.

Noguchi10 years ago?

SukezaneMaybe earlier? The 90s?

NoguchiProbably.

SukezaneAround 2000 or '99, I think. Tom Ford must have had a good eye for that kind of thing.

NoguchiYes.




SukezaneDefinitely. Klein was famous, but I didn't expect him to become this successful.

NoguchiYes, yes, yes.

SukezaneHe was overweight back then, wasn't he?

NoguchiHe was, normally.

SukezaneRight. We went drinking until morning in Paris after that, didn't we?

NoguchiYes, yes.

SukezaneYou were unrecognizable, you'd lost so much weight.

NoguchiHe had changed completely.

SukezaneIt's strange.

Continued in Conversation with Tomoki Sukezane & Editor Daimao Vol. 8 (Part 2)

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Notes

^※1Yamamotoyama
A food manufacturer that produces seaweed and tea. Widely known for the slogan "Yamamotoyama, read it forwards or backwards."

^※2Jeans Mate
A company that operates a chain of clothing stores primarily selling jeans.

^※3Ozashiki Denim
Denim with stretch that makes it comfortable to sit on tatami mats for long periods without knee pain, suitable for Japanese-style rooms or tatami areas.

^※4Rigid
Also known as raw denim or non-wash. Denim that is shipped with its original sizing applied and has not been washed.

^※5Tokiokumagai
A brand by the late fashion designer Tokuo Kumagai. Also known as the first Japanese shoe designer to achieve success in Paris. Announced a watch series named "Clock that makes you forget time" from SEIKO. Passed away in 1987.

^※6Kiyonaga-kun
Hirofumi Kiyonaga, founder of the apparel brand SOPHNET.

^※7Gabor
A silver accessory brand by the late genius jeweler Gabor Nagy. Said to have a status and price comparable to Chrome Hearts, with many celebrity fans.

^※8Mano
Owner of the street brand RATS, which started in 2004 focusing on T-shirt graphics.

^※9Chaine d'Ancre
Considered a classic and major item among HERMES bracelets. Chaine d'Ancre means "anchor chain" and symbolizes a strong bond.

^※10Steven Klein
A photographer from Rhode Island, USA. Known for his dark, dramatic compositions, he has created editorials for numerous fashion magazines and campaign visuals for many high-end brands such as Dolce & Gabbana and Louis Vuitton.

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